I Challenge Josephine County Oregon Sheriff Gilbertson to Ar - I would just like to say a few things that were on my mind tonight. It's time for all of us to own up to what's going on in this country and in this world. It's time to pull our heads out of the sand. How many people here KNOW and ACKNOWLEDGE (not de

Newbie Joined: Apr 29, 2007 Posts: 46

I ran across this and thought it was very insightful.

Quote:

Akahige's Rules of Causes

For every cause, there exists spokespersons who produce more negative images, feelings, press, and other sundry effects regarding the cause.

The most extreme elements of that cause will tout the same spokesperson(s) as the saviour of the movement.

The same spokesperson is usually the loudest voice in the room and if not chosen as the saviour of the movement, will appoint themselves as such.

If the saviour of the movement is criticized, questioned, or it appears they are challenged by others, the backers of that saviour will attack, excoriate, deride the perceived attackers.

Once a Saviour of the Movement has been appointed/annointed the cause becomes religious in nature and has less to do with reason and more to do with jihadist fervor.

Site Admin Joined: Apr 03, 2007 Posts: 580

Does this guy say anything about people sent to infiltrate and stir dissent, demoralize, distract, confuse, and ultimately neutralize the effort?

Newbie Joined: Apr 29, 2007 Posts: 46

Not sure. I found it in an environmental discussion in a technology forum. I think he was targetting Gore, but he made sense.

In this, you have Ed and Elaine. Quiet voices I think. Then you have the loud mouths that almost always hijack a movement, and while for a while it seems its going in the right direction, it is usually on some Quixotic quest, and the movement actually loses more ground.

Site Admin Joined: Apr 03, 2007 Posts: 580

You know what, just leave, Purple. I've been wanting you to leave for a long time. Now I'm asking you to leave.

Everyone knows you aren't here for the right reasons. It is YOU who is trying to derail the movement. Please don't post here -- you're not welcome. Adios.

Newbie Joined: Apr 29, 2007 Posts: 46

Wow, Shaun, I think I've shown compassion and caring for Ed and Elaine's case. I think those who want to see it come down to a "final" conflict are the ones that will cause massive problems.

While it is true, I don't believe in everything you do, its that difference that allows for good discussion.

I believe one can work within the system to assist.

However, the biggest sign of a tyranny is the silencing of not only dissent, but of any other idea that does not toe the line of the leadership.

Beware, there are provacateurs in your ranks. They are going to make suggestions that might sound very good, and like you are going to "put it to the man". I'd hate to see that happen. However, at this point, I don't think I can help you.

You don't want to discussion, you don't want dialogue. You have your fiefdom built on sand provided by those who would love to see your downfall.

Now, I have specifically avoided Ray, except for the one case where he was so obviously speaking out his keester. Thinking that someone who talks about creating bio-diesel as an alternative to the government and corporate RICO gangs known as oil companies, as trying to get someone arrested is assinine.

Beware of Ray, if you disagree with one jot, one tittle of what he says, he will start calling names, he will turn any discussion into his demagogue.

Not everyone who chats with you agrees with you on every point. But something in common brings people together.

I was here for the right reasons. I sympathize with Ed and Elaine. I look for ways to work within the system. Make it work in my life.

Yeah, I'll leave. What you will get is a bunch of people who "agree" with each other and won't really discuss anything, you will just keep validating your ideas, the provacateurs will slip in, you'll start validating their ideas. Eventually, you will find that you've chilled any true discussion, and that you may actually be heading towards a precipice you never thought you'd approach.

If there is a blaze of glory, it will be your own tragedy.

Bye, Shaun.

I enjoyed the discourse. But I see I was wrong for share ideas.

Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 4:36 pm

I Challenge Josephine County Oregon Sheriff Gilbertson to Arrest Me!

Raymond Karczewski (arkent3@earthlink.net) wrote:

rk: Note the line below: "94801POSTED!127.0.0.1!postie!trvth!baronlurk!wolphe!stone!krg!bookman!lits!gator!gorilla!widdershins!wilkinson!!truncated-path"

rk: These are some of the aliases used by purple shroud of karma and his disinformation cohorts, all of whom have been successfully detected by shaun and removed from this forum.

rk: They will come back under other names, of that you can be sure. They have no purpose other than to distract, misdirect, confuse, slander and confuse. this is their latest attack on USENET because I have not been posting lately.

rk: When I am not there, they just make it up. There are countless forgeries posted to foreign countries under my name with my picture removed from my website. It is no small operation. It has become a chore just to track down these forgeries. By the way, the post below was written by chadwick stone aka chardwick sloan as he appeared on this forum.

rk: The purpose for my writing this is to awaken you to what most people never see while the Truth lies right under their noses. To awaken is to see.
To see is to act. If one only excuses what they have seen, it is the same ignorance that prevails in the conditioned hypnotic sleep.

rk: Its TIME TO WAKE UP!!

Konvict Kampaign Manager write: 94801POSTED!127.0.0.1!postie!trvth!baronlurk!wolphe!stone!krg!bookman!lits!gator!gorilla!widdershins!wilkinson!!truncated-path
From: Konvict Kampaign Manager 94801 <konvict>
Subject: Re: Ray KarKookzy Shut Down!!!
References: <Xns9943D02388583RayTroll> <konvict>
Subject: Re: Ray KarKookzy Shut Down!!!
References: <Xns9943D02388583RayTroll>
Organization: Kampaign to Award Raymond Karczewski the Richard M. Nixon Pathological Liar Award
X-No-Archive: Yes
X-Authorized: konvict.kampaign@127.0.0.1
X-Remember: Raymond Karczewski is a Liar
Expires: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 00:00:01 -0000
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X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2007 12:55:09 GMT
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crb9000: >> On 2007-06-03, CRB9000 <arkent3> wrote:
Looks like Ray got his ass handed to him and he's afraid to post now. Ray got caught in a huge ol' contradiction of essense, got caught in an incredible dualism of thought.

kkm: > You better believe it! The man of inaction was advising people to commit felony vandalism and the goodly Sheriff was not amused.

rk: Do you mean ""TAKE BACK YOUR CAMERA" Day Could Well Become the "Symbolic" Boston Tea Party Answer of Sovereigns Making a Clear Statement of Freedom Against the New World Order." ? See: http://www.arkenterprises.com/dialch212.html#CAMERA

kkm: > Feel free to send him a note (ggilbertson@co.josephine.or.us) and let him know that a number of people are worried that these crimes could pose a danger and decrease public safety.

rk: You sleazy jerks are a real piece of work, aren't you?. You hide behind multiple aliases like cowards and you work the "Barabbas crowd" who are but one step up from your debased, guttersniping. How Satanic of you!!

rk: While your sending him your notes in your clear-cut demonstration of a conspiratorial campaign to have me arrested remind him (sheriff gilbertson) to hold on to all of the emails he has received from your destination (as I have with the above header) for evidence for future prosecution of you yahoos for the crime of Conspiracy to libel, internet harrassment, Stalking, etc. Oh yes, also remind him to bring along his "proof of jurisdiction" accompanied by affidavit over this "simple living, breathing, flesh-and-blood, sentient, natural man of Truth should he be so foolish as to arrest me for my internet communications.

crb9000: >>> Ray, I think, has exposed himself to his mirror of truth and found out that he is a disinformation agent, and that he is his own worst enemy. His impotent rage is about to explode.

kkm: > There is a chance that the felon is already back in jail for his criminal advertisement.

rk: Not much of one. I'm still here at home, at my computer as you can see, a FREE MAN.

kkm: > If the corpsewife starts posting at his behest, you'll know
that to be the case.

rk: You government/disinformation yahoos have idle time on your hands, Even when I don't post, your need to continue your Libelous smear campaign against me doesn't allow you much rest, does it?

rk: Hell, isn't it?

Raymond Ronald Karczewski©

Newbie Joined: Apr 29, 2007 Posts: 46

Ray,

After I "Handed you your ass" in that last discussion, you fell silent. Now, after I make my exit you come back to crow. Coward.

Now,
I am out.

Site Admin Joined: Apr 03, 2007 Posts: 580

I would just like to say a few things that were on my mind tonight.

It's time for all of us to own up to what's going on in this country and in this world. It's time to pull our heads out of the sand. How many people here KNOW and ACKNOWLEDGE (not deny) that 9/11/01 was an INSIDE JOB? With this in mind, doesn't that make you upset?

Let's get one thing straight. I don't want happy, content people on this site. I'm serious. If you are content with the way things are right now, just leave. We don't need you. I want people to be pissed off about what's going on, because perhaps if enough people get pissed off something might get done for a change! How can we remember 9/11 and not be OUTRAGED!!!!! We go back to our daily lives, our families, our friends, our music, our movies, our sports, our DISTRACTIONS. This shit is real, people -- this is the REAL DEAL!

I admitted to myself today, that if I weren't such a coward, I would be organizing a large group of armed MILITIA (people, yes, those same people that are SUPPOSED to make up the government), and would be taking over government buildings and kicking the criminals out. This wouldn't need to be violent, of course -- ideally the violent criminals who reside in these buildings should leave without a fight.

What I'm talking about right here is what SHOULD be done. Since I am a coward, I will not organize such an event. How many here can say different? How many here can deny that we're at the point that warrants the removal of the criminals by threat of force?

OVER 3,000 AMERICANS KILLED ON 9/11/01. WE DON'T RIGHTLY KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PEOPLE IN THE HIJACKED PLANES EITHER, AS THERE IS AMPLE EVIDENCE TO SHOW THOSE PLANES (WITH THOSE PEOPLE) DID NOT HIT THE BUILDINGS OR CRASH IN PA.

Is it not time? If not now, then when? Go re-read the excerpt from the Patrick Henry speech on the home page. We are living under MUCH greater tyranny than before the Revolutionary War! So now what?

What will YOU do?

I was thinking about America today, and seeing how masterfully this has all been designed. Almost everything we think we need has been taken care of for us. We have grocery stores right down the street. We have nice little houses with little lawns. We have parks. We have our entertainment and distractions. WE HAVE OUR BREAD AND CIRCUSES!!!

When you get off of this thread after reading this -- when you go back to "real life" as it is put, I want you to think of one thing. Remember, PLEASE remember, September 11th, and all of the lives that were lost. Think of all the families -- families just like your own -- that were torn apart because of lost loved ones. Keep this in mind when you're in the car, when you're eating a burger, when you're going to the movies, when you're watching the TV, when you're shopping for groceries, and especially as you "work" and earn your meager living (yes, I can say meager, because mine is meager, as it is for most people...even the "wealthy" don't realize what little they have accumulated and how easily it can be taken away).

Please realize that THIS HAS ALL BEEN SETUP AHEAD OF TIME so that we will be content with what we have and that we will not fight what is coming. This is a game of chess, and we are the pawns! It's time to get pissed and STAY PISSED over what has happened -- not just 9/11 but everything else. It's sickening! Stop the wars, the corporations, the torture, the killing, the tyranny of world domination. Let's stop this shit now.

Do NOT put this out of your mind -- do NOT go back to "normal" life -- stop being content. It's time for all of us to be malcontents and get something done here finally.